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Old 14th June 2014, 08:03 AM   #21
3dd13
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quite unsure if this is the best location, but has anyone figured out SDSME thurroughly? while b2 may not be the best base, i did note major flaws for a beginner. Warping is typically go to map **** location **x** where **** is map id, and **x** is coordinates. the first flaw is that using twinleaf town as an example, if you look at the warp exiting the players house, it warps to a logical location in twinleaf town. however the warp for the players house is something like 875x125 which due to the grid design is highly illogical and i cannot figure it out. the next problem is other events, such as scripts and signposts which also have that issue. the next problem i see is the models. if you look at a model, it has x/y coordinates for location on a map, followed by other numbers. once again, there is little documentation to help one figure out how to effectively use this tool. if i understood mapping in the first place, i would rewrite it for a more user friendly structure. but even so, it is highly illogical and for once, i cannot understand it even after weeks of trying to. If i cannot figure out at minimum how to place my warps and locations, i cannot make my hack. i havent even seen spiky around, nor has his alleged next release poped up which supposedly fixes a lot of things.
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Old 14th June 2014, 03:10 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by 3dd13 View Post
quite unsure if this is the best location, but has anyone figured out SDSME thurroughly? while b2 may not be the best base, i did note major flaws for a beginner. Warping is typically go to map **** location **x** where **** is map id, and **x** is coordinates. the first flaw is that using twinleaf town as an example, if you look at the warp exiting the players house, it warps to a logical location in twinleaf town. however the warp for the players house is something like 875x125 which due to the grid design is highly illogical and i cannot figure it out. the next problem is other events, such as scripts and signposts which also have that issue. the next problem i see is the models. if you look at a model, it has x/y coordinates for location on a map, followed by other numbers. once again, there is little documentation to help one figure out how to effectively use this tool. if i understood mapping in the first place, i would rewrite it for a more user friendly structure. but even so, it is highly illogical and for once, i cannot understand it even after weeks of trying to. If i cannot figure out at minimum how to place my warps and locations, i cannot make my hack. i havent even seen spiky around, nor has his alleged next release poped up which supposedly fixes a lot of things.
The way it works is that all overworld sprites and warps are based upon the entire map matrix itself. That means that a sprite/warp position of 0,0 is all the way the most Northwest corner of the map (Or, for those interested, Mystery Zone). This is because the sprites and warps are not stored with the map, rather, they're all placed on an incredibly large grid. However, buildings and whatnot start at the top-left corner of any 32x32 map section, and are stored with map data, hence why they have much lower numbers. It's not SDSME's fault that this occurs, it's the way Game Freak implemented the entire system. I know there was a Lua script that you could use to place sprites properly because it'd display the X/Y/Z coordinates of the player to you in realtime, but I don't know where one could find it anymore.
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Old 14th June 2014, 09:49 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Team Fail View Post
The way it works is that all overworld sprites and warps are based upon the entire map matrix itself. That means that a sprite/warp position of 0,0 is all the way the most Northwest corner of the map (Or, for those interested, Mystery Zone). This is because the sprites and warps are not stored with the map, rather, they're all placed on an incredibly large grid. However, buildings and whatnot start at the top-left corner of any 32x32 map section, and are stored with map data, hence why they have much lower numbers. It's not SDSME's fault that this occurs, it's the way Game Freak implemented the entire system. I know there was a Lua script that you could use to place sprites properly because it'd display the X/Y/Z coordinates of the player to you in realtime, but I don't know where one could find it anymore.
err could you explain in a bit more detail? That actually helps out a lot believe it or not. as for that lua script, i have it and actively use it. i still havent figured out how to work with script to editor however. the main problem is when one imports a smaller proportion map... wait... isnt every map 30x30? if thats the case.... I think i got an idea. I still think the editor needs a bit of a revamp and more explinations for the newbies to understand whats going on, a decent tutorial or something. I am game once i figure it out, but for now, i could use any help possible.

and for the record, the script only seems to work in b/w/2 which makes it useless for figuring things out as SDSME doesnt show events for b2.
on a further note, lua's for previous gens are floating around, however they are nowhere near as propelry made as the b2w2 one, and once again, this presents a problem when working with a map editor that doesnt show events or scripts. I have considered looking into white version, however i am not sure if the lua script will work with it, or if SDSME edits b/w events.

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Old 15th June 2014, 05:25 AM   #24
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err could you explain in a bit more detail? That actually helps out a lot believe it or not. as for that lua script, i have it and actively use it. i still havent figured out how to work with script to editor however. the main problem is when one imports a smaller proportion map... wait... isnt every map 30x30? if thats the case.... I think i got an idea. I still think the editor needs a bit of a revamp and more explinations for the newbies to understand whats going on, a decent tutorial or something. I am game once i figure it out, but for now, i could use any help possible.

and for the record, the script only seems to work in b/w/2 which makes it useless for figuring things out as SDSME doesnt show events for b2.
on a further note, lua's for previous gens are floating around, however they are nowhere near as propelry made as the b2w2 one, and once again, this presents a problem when working with a map editor that doesnt show events or scripts. I have considered looking into white version, however i am not sure if the lua script will work with it, or if SDSME edits b/w events.
I'm thinking in terms of 4th Generation, so those measurements may change a tad in 5th Gen, or else I'm wrong, but I'm sure each map is 32x32. Anyways, allow me to explain it a bit better for you.

Imagine a grid. Such as those grid papers you use in Math class for drawing graphs. Now imagine cutting out a 25x25 square from that piece of grid paper, with about an inch on each side for a scale. Now imagine you start numbering them, from the top left corner, going downwards in multiples of 10, as well as to the left in multiples of 10. You'll have a 250x250 graph at this point. Each of those 250 on each side is how sprites and scripts are laid out over the map matrix. This is done because scripts are completely separate data from maps. The only relation they have is that they're mentioned in the map header, which defines scripts, maps, music, and whatnot.

Now, let's take the exact same graph, and cut out one 10x10 section square. This is one in-game map. From there, it's split itself into smaller sections. This graph has it in a 10x10 array, but the games do it in their own way. This is used for placing models on the map. Each map is referenced individually, so model data is only loaded for that map at a time, and this is because the model data in the smaller grid is located in the map's data itself. It's really weird, I know, but this is about the best I can explain it.
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Old 15th June 2014, 09:12 AM   #25
3dd13
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OK, but the only problem i see is in platinum for example, the x/y coordinate for the players warp location exceeds a logical 250x250, or is that coordinate calculated by both that 250x250 and 10x10? I hate to be a d**k but is there a way you can show this graphically somehow? while i fillow that the locations for scripts and such are seperate, they still reference locations on a map. it doesnt make logical sense using said numbers how the values are calculated. at this moment, i will reference that warp to the players house in dpplt. exiting the house points to a logical and calculable location on the map for twinleaf that you can actually see on the grid. going back into the players house however doesnt. i tried everything i could think of to figure out how GF got that value, and still couldnt figure anything but it was a virtual location reference. I am still stuck on 3rd gen terms as far as mapping goes, so this is a big clusterfrack to me. i have also noted that the locations for the buildings is seperate from the main map. I tried using the header numbers in calculations and such to no avail. no matter what i did, i couldnt figure out how they got that coordinate to warp the player to. forget npc's for now. forget the actual wapr in rom. for now i am talking about the locations referenced in the warp. these should logically reference to map locations. after all, the headers always match to the correct map.
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